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Animal Combinations; Mixed exhibits questions
Topic Started: Nov 23 2014, 09:51 PM (123,739 Views)
stargatedalek
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I'm not slow! That's just my moe!

Uolym
Mar 2 2017, 12:32 AM
Is there anything I could mix with a pair of African Palm Civet in a big indoor nocturnal exhibit?
I can't find anything about keeping them with other animals, but generally they don't need very large exhibits so you could probably split it.
https://www.zoochat.com/community/media/african-palm-civet-enclosure-at-the-new-zoo-poznan-sept-08.17618/
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Red Tycooner103
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stargatedalek
Mar 1 2017, 11:44 PM
Red103
Mar 1 2017, 08:37 PM
TheToastinator
Mar 1 2017, 07:00 PM
Could I keep Pteranodon and Ornithocheirus together, with possibly adding Ikrandraco? If the Ikrandraco doesn't work, can I combine it with Ramphorynchus?
You might be better off just using two of those. As long as there's enough room in the exhibit and they're not directly competing for food then you should be fine. Or if you would consider it, maybe only exhibit small pterosaurs like the Rhamphorynchus and maybe something like Dimorphodon or Cavaramus. You wouldn't have to worry about one species preying or bullying the others as much.
Rhamphorynchus is a small diving piscivore, Dimorphodon is a forest dwelling insect specialist. They would require very different enclosures.
Not necessarily. As long as he's creative enough with the enclosure then he should be fine. I know it's fictional but the Jurassic World Aviary kept both Pteranodon, a large coastal piscavore, and Dimporphodon, a small forest dwelling insectivore, in the same exhibit and both species got along fine. Like I said I know its from a movie about cloned prehistoric animals but since theres no real world examples of such an exhibit then its my only source to reference. That said as long as any enclosure meets the needs of the animal(s) then it should be fine.
Edited by Red Tycooner103, Mar 2 2017, 01:33 AM.
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magpiealamode
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No good hero is a one-trick phony.

I think he could definitely work it, although JW is about the last place I would go for reference. Zoos have been coming up with creative ways to house differente species together for a long time, it's kinda their thing. I'd definitely avoid putting both of those in an exhibit with something bigger though, and I'd also be cautious about housing large species together, due to space requirements.
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Furka
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JW or litterally just movies in general have 0 logic behind what they show beside the "let's do it because it's cool looking" so they are far from being even a poor choice for a reference.

So regarding the pterosaurs in question, I wouldn't put the others with Pteranodon. Assuming they'd end up fighting even for small stuff like roosting sites or food, toothed pterosaurs could seriously harm it. Not to mention the amount of space you'd need to house just one of those already.
Smaller pterosaurs could work (assuming they don't get stressed out by being kept with the larger animals) but most definately not Dimorphodon, being a forest animal it would require trees and similar, not good for an animal like Pteranodon which needs large open areas for flying.
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Anton
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King of Cotingas

@Uolym, I think a combination with 'another viverrid' (though African palm civets are, of course, not viverrids) might have potential to work. Singapore night safari keeps Malayan civet and small-toothed palm civet together in a medium-sized enclosure and they seem to do fine.

However, I personally wouldn't even consider African civet because of the immense size difference, so if you want to stay remotely geographical that limits you to Genetta and Poiana. The thing about that is that while Singapore's combination consists of a terrestrial and an arboreal species, Nandinia and either of 2 mentioned genuses are both arboreal, which may or may not clash; in all honesty, I just don't know.

Either way, surely they're interesting enough to give their own enclosure altogether? ;)
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Anthracite
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Jony
Mar 1 2017, 06:23 PM
Why is it cruel?
It's positive enrichment for both species and works just fine. In Leipzig Zoo in Germany two female cheetahs live together with a black rhino bull. The rhino doesn't really mind the cheetahs and the cheetahs are smart enough to keep a few meters of distance. As a visitor it's nice too see the interactions between both species.
I guess it's a similar situation in Boras.



Animales
Mar 1 2017, 06:45 PM
The cheetah isn't equipped to harm the rhino in any possible way. The rhino isn't as agile or swift (rhinos are fast but not cheetah fast) as the cheetah. They also won't see each other competition for their respective food sources.

If you truly fear that the black rhino is too aggressive maybe try the (southern)white rhino? They aren't as aggressive and are more social.



I would have thought it would cause them both unnecessary stress, I'd be a nervous wreck if I saw them together :S

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Jony
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@Anthracite:
Don't worry, a bit stress is not bad. ;) In the wild both cheetahs and rhinos have stress sometimes.
Since the life in captivity is more boring than in the wild, those combinations which cause a bit stress are enriching the animals in a very positive way. As long as both species have their own private area, which the other species can't reach, it should be totally fine.
Of course there shouldn't be too much stress but this rhino/cheetah combination works for years now, so I think it's fine.

In addition, I have visited Leipzig a few times and the cheetahs were always really relaxed and even tried out how close they could come to the rhino. And he didn't mind the cheetahs coming closer. ;)
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Uolym
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Anton
Mar 2 2017, 03:51 PM
@Uolym, I think a combination with 'another viverrid' (though African palm civets are, of course, not viverrids) might have potential to work. Singapore night safari keeps Malayan civet and small-toothed palm civet together in a medium-sized enclosure and they seem to do fine.

However, I personally wouldn't even consider African civet because of the immense size difference, so if you want to stay remotely geographical that limits you to Genetta and Poiana. The thing about that is that while Singapore's combination consists of a terrestrial and an arboreal species, Nandinia and either of 2 mentioned genuses are both arboreal, which may or may not clash; in all honesty, I just don't know.

Either way, surely they're interesting enough to give their own enclosure altogether? ;)
Thank you very much! I do think they are perfect on their own, but I just realized the exhibit is huge for a pair! :P

Maybe mongoose?
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Furka
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I don't really know anything about civet behavior, but what about crested porcupines ?
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Anton
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King of Cotingas

Mongoose I think would be too agressive, unless you went with for example dwarf mongoose, but then those might be vulnerable towards the palm civets. :P

Porcupine might not even be such a crazy idea, actually!
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Anthracite
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Jony
Mar 2 2017, 05:26 PM
@Anthracite:
Don't worry, a bit stress is not bad. ;) In the wild both cheetahs and rhinos have stress sometimes.
Since the life in captivity is more boring than in the wild, those combinations which cause a bit stress are enriching the animals in a very positive way. As long as both species have their own private area, which the other species can't reach, it should be totally fine.
Of course there shouldn't be too much stress but this rhino/cheetah combination works for years now, so I think it's fine.

In addition, I have visited Leipzig a few times and the cheetahs were always really relaxed and even tried out how close they could come to the rhino. And he didn't mind the cheetahs coming closer. ;)
Ok, well I'm a worrier. I wouldn't be able to relax if I saw them :/
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Cowrie
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There's a few aquatic combos I'd like to ask about.

First, American paddlefish, blue catfish, channel catfish, flathead catfish, black bullhead, shortnose gar, bluegill, bowfin, walleye, smallmouth buffalo, bigmouth buffalo, white crappie, and black crappie.

Two, a mix of sterlet, wels catfish, northern pike, brown trout, barbel, and European perch. Obviously, the big concern here is the wels, so if it would be an issue, would everything else be okay without it?

Next, Chinese high fin banded shark, Chinese giant salamander and Chinese minnow.

Finally, I was wondering if an electric catfish could be housed with appropriately sized fish also from the Nile, such as marbled lungfish, Nile tilapia or African tigerfish, or would they need to be kept along because of electrical discharges?
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Furka
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1- I'd keep out the black bullhead, maybe crappies too.
2- I'd keep out both wels and pike.
3- I don't know if giant salamanders can be kept with fish, but if they are then I think it's doable.
4- if they are anything like electric eels, I wouldn't house them with other fish except maybe for small, expendable ones (electric eels are kept with tetras sometimes).
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stargatedalek
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I'm not slow! That's just my moe!

Giant salamanders won't do well with similarly sized fish. They like to live in comparatively shallow water for their size. You could try mixing them with very small fish, but the fish might be eaten occasionally.
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Cowrie
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Recommendations noted.

Furka
Mar 4 2017, 05:09 PM
4- if they are anything like electric eels, I wouldn't house them with other fish except maybe for small, expendable ones (electric eels are kept with tetras sometimes).


From what I've read, they seem to fall about halfway between something like the electric eel and "mildly electrogenic" fish. While their pulses are used for hunting and defense rather than just navigation, the shocks aren't strong enough to be dangerous to something man-sized. Seeing as tilapia pretty much fit the bill for "expendable fish", despite being larger than tetras, perhaps it would be best to just stick to the tilapia.

stargatedalek
 
Giant salamanders won't do well with similarly sized fish. They like to live in comparatively shallow water for their size. You could try mixing them with very small fish, but the fish might be eaten occasionally.


Understood. My logic was that they both originate in fast-flowing mountain stretches of the Yangtze, but I guess the requirements aren't that similar. Do you know of any very small fish from that region, because when I search Fishbase, everything under six inches or so in the Yangtze isn't from the right environment.
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