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| Extinct Animal Questions | |
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| Topic Started: Nov 26 2013, 10:24 PM (193,359 Views) | |
| godsaurus | Sep 5 2015, 12:31 PM Post #2026 |
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One question: are Triceratops and Torosaurus the same or no? (i'm sorry but I just want to know) |
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| BossMan, Jake | Sep 5 2015, 12:37 PM Post #2027 |
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Son of God
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No they are different |
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| babehunter1324 | Sep 5 2015, 02:19 PM Post #2028 |
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Well I wouldn't categorically say that we are sure that they were two different genus for sure with the current evidence... That said with the current evidence (two different species within Torosaurus with differently shaped frills, possible subadult Torosaurus , Torosaurus latus being only sympatric with Triceratops horridus but not Triceratops prorsus and Torosaurus utahensis being sympatic with whatever Ojoceratops is) I think it is the most likely hypothesis of the two. We need more fossils to be really sure, IMO. Edited by babehunter1324, Sep 5 2015, 02:21 PM.
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| Incinerox | Sep 5 2015, 02:28 PM Post #2029 |
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti
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We at least have enough to say that the only two confirmed Torosaurus remains we have were both objectively older than all known Triceratops fossils. |
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| Luca9108 | Sep 5 2015, 02:53 PM Post #2030 |
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Master of Dinosaurs
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Are they older than T.rex too? |
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| Paleodude | Sep 5 2015, 06:34 PM Post #2031 |
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ex-Krampus
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What's the general consensus of Spinosaurus at the moment; is it a quadruped like the new study shows or is Scott Hartman correct with his more recent reconstruction? Scott's is the one on the bottom |
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| CyborgIguana | Sep 5 2015, 06:38 PM Post #2032 |
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We don't know if it was a knuckle-walker like that reconstruction shows (almost certainly wouldn't have been one 24/7 in any case), but we do know that the shorter leg proportions are more accurate (Scott Hartmann's were discredited). |
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| Joe99 | Sep 5 2015, 07:09 PM Post #2033 |
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How Alamosaurus came to live within the United States at the end of the Cretaceous is a question that has caused some confusion for some since for a long time the popular conception of sauropods was that they mostly disappeared from North America at the end of the Jurassic. This idea is based upon the observation that fossils of sauropods were more common in North America at the end of the Jurassic, but seem to have been replaced by ornithischians like hadrosaurs and later on ceratopsian dinosaurs during the Cretaceous. However the saying that absence of evidence is not necessarily evidence of absence is commonly used in palaeontology, and slowly but surely Cretaceous age sauropods are slowly but surely being discovered in North America with examples including Astrodon, Sauroposeidon and Cedarosaurus amongst others. Slowly, Cretaceous sauropod (or rather more specifically titanosaur) genera are coming together to help complete a picture of the dinosaurian fauna of North American ecosystems where titanosaur sauropods are actually still quite common, although still perhaps not as common as their late Jurassic ancestors. There are too alternative theories concerning how Alamosaurus came to live in North America. One is a direct Asian origin where Alamosaurus or immediate ancestors to it crossed the Bering Strait land bridge and spread down to the south-western regions where the habitat may have remained more suitable for a stable and permanent population. This is in part supported by the placement of Alamosaurus within the Opisthocoelicaudiinae group of titanosaurs, the type genus of which, Opisthocoelicaudia, is currently only known from Asia. However this group also sits within the Saltasauridae and Alamosaurus is seen to have a lot of similarities with the type genus of this group, Saltasaurus. This has led to speculation of a South American origin for Alamosaurus, although the main problem here is that South America is thought to have been separated from North America during the Cretaceous by ocean. Additionally other strictly South American dinosaurs such as the abelisaur theropods are still not known in North America, and vice versa, North American dinosaurs like tyrannosaurs are not known in South America. Altogether the arguments for a South American origin are not that convincing, but one possibility that may explain these similarities is convergent evolution. This is simply where two animals (or in this case dinosaurs) that are separated by time and/or geography find themselves in the same survival conditions and so physically change to carry near identical adaptations for coping with their survival requirements. This principal has been observed countless times, and where the animals share a common ancestor and similar biology, the similarity is just the more likely to occur. |
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| Incinerox | Sep 5 2015, 09:03 PM Post #2034 |
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti
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So how come Kritosaurus's relatives are known from Asia, North America and South America? |
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| Yi Qi | Sep 5 2015, 09:45 PM Post #2035 |
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There have been, it seems, atleast a minor interchange between north and south america, with saltasaurids and avisaurus (and likely megaraptorids if we get to confirm Dryptosaurus's status as one) suddenly appearing on the north american landmasses and Secernosaurus and atleast one possible ceratopsian suddenly appearing in south america during the same timeframe. How did this happen? Who the hell knows.... Edited by Yi Qi, Sep 5 2015, 09:47 PM.
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| Tyranachu | Sep 6 2015, 01:20 AM Post #2036 |
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Nerdasaurus
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![]() Did Pinacosaurus really have those big side spikes? Because I see a lot of reconstructions without them and I'm pretty unsure about it now. |
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| Incinerox | Sep 6 2015, 01:52 AM Post #2037 |
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti
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@Austro: To be fair, the Avisaurids likely had Asian origins. Most are known from North America, but the most primitive ones are Asian (ranging from China to Lebanon). As for everything else, yeah, there's gotta be some explanation for it all. I'll need more paleogeographic maps though. It's annoying in that a lot of them are inconsistent. @Tyranchu: Yes. Those were a thing. Assuming MPC 100/1305 is a Pinacosaurus. All the other ones are, while in decent condition skeletally, not particularly complete in their osteoderm arrangement. As for why other restorations exist, I suppose it's the same condition where people call this "Ankylosaurus":
Edited by Incinerox, Sep 6 2015, 01:54 AM.
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| Even | Sep 6 2015, 03:58 AM Post #2038 |
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Well, Dryptosaurus might have been descended from relatives of Siats (there WERE megaraptorans in North America, and some might have crossed over to Appalachia before the landmass was cut to half) |
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| Incinerox | Sep 6 2015, 04:50 AM Post #2039 |
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti
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Was Siats a Megaraptoran? Or a Neovenatorid? They got mixed up ROYALLY, and we don't really have much of Siats. |
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| babehunter1324 | Sep 6 2015, 05:04 AM Post #2040 |
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^^ I think that the only cladistic analysis of Siats performed so far claimed that Megaraptorids were within Neovenatorids, so we will have to wait for further cladistic/filogenetic analysis to know what Siats (and all Megaraptorids, really) truelly were. |
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