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Extinct Animal Questions
Topic Started: Nov 26 2013, 10:24 PM (193,233 Views)
At0m
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What are the morphological differences between the Cave Lion (P. spelaea spelaea) and modern lions?
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Incinerox
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti

At0m
Dec 6 2017, 10:23 PM
What are the morphological differences between the Cave Lion (P. spelaea spelaea) and modern lions?
Lrn2Google.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Panthera_leo_spelaea




I'm attempting to create a Deltadromeus skeletal. Or maybe a Gualicho skeletal since Sereno doesn't understand the point of a scientific description. Latest studies place it as a basal noasaurid outside of noasaurinae and elaphrosaurinae.

So is it better to use Masiakasaurus to fill in the blanks? Or should I look to Elaphrosaurus instead?
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stargatedalek
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I'm not slow! That's just my moe!

Incinerox
Dec 10 2017, 04:17 AM
I'm attempting to create a Deltadromeus skeletal. Or maybe a Gualicho skeletal since Sereno doesn't understand the point of a scientific description. Latest studies place it as a basal noasaurid outside of noasaurinae and elaphrosaurinae.

So is it better to use Masiakasaurus to fill in the blanks? Or should I look to Elaphrosaurus instead?
Last I heard they were still basal Neovenatoridae, but that was around a year ago now and they've been all over the place within the last few years. Still, even with a new placement the value of convergent examples for very sparse remains isn't something to be overlooked. If you really need some guides to potential ways the gaps may have been filled in, these animals were previously assigned to Neovenatoridae and Megaraptora for a reason.

If they are basal Noasauridae than the sad truth is that neither Masiakasaurus or Elaphrosaurus is any better of a reference than the other. That being said Elaphrosaurus is slightly more complete so that's what I would use.
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Incinerox
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti

stargatedalek
Dec 10 2017, 01:39 PM
Incinerox
Dec 10 2017, 04:17 AM
I'm attempting to create a Deltadromeus skeletal. Or maybe a Gualicho skeletal since Sereno doesn't understand the point of a scientific description. Latest studies place it as a basal noasaurid outside of noasaurinae and elaphrosaurinae.

So is it better to use Masiakasaurus to fill in the blanks? Or should I look to Elaphrosaurus instead?


Last I heard they were still basal Neovenatoridae, but that was around a year ago now and they've been all over the place within the last few years. Still, even with a new placement the value of convergent examples for very sparse remains isn't something to be overlooked. If you really need some guides to potential ways the gaps may have been filled in, these animals were previously assigned to Neovenatoridae and Megaraptora for a reason.

If they are basal Noasauridae than the sad truth is that neither Masiakasaurus or Elaphrosaurus is any better of a reference than the other. That being said Elaphrosaurus is slightly more complete so that's what I would use.
That was the Gualicho paper that put them with "Neovenatoridae", weirdly. And it was Aoniraptor's description that put them with Megaraptora as coelurosaurs within days apart. Yet neither paper made reference to either Patagonian theropod, which are possibly synonyms anyway.

But beyond those two, subsequent papers and previous papers keep circling Deltadromeus back to basal noasauridae.

The main problem I'm facing with this project I'm taking on is, naturally, the skull. The limbs I have data for, the vertebrae I have data for, but I'm forced to weigh up restoring it based on Masiakasaurus's skull against Limusaurus's skull. A specialised carnivore vs a specialised herbivore, when I'm probably looking at something that's probably not going to be overly specialised in either direction.
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stargatedalek
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I'm not slow! That's just my moe!

Incinerox
Dec 11 2017, 11:28 AM
The main problem I'm facing with this project I'm taking on is, naturally, the skull. The limbs I have data for, the vertebrae I have data for, but I'm forced to weigh up restoring it based on Masiakasaurus's skull against Limusaurus's skull. A specialised carnivore vs a specialised herbivore, when I'm probably looking at something that's probably not going to be overly specialised in either direction.
I would use Masiakasaurus as much as possible but try to avoid copying the distinctive "hooks" to its jaws that are probably dependent on its dentition. Of course, the upper front half of Masiakasaurus skull isn't known anyway, and conveniently is for Limusaurus, so you might actually need to do a bit of a composite regardless.
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Tyranachu
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Nerdasaurus

What happened to depicting quills on ceratopsians? Lately I've been seeing less and less reconstructions of ceratopsians with quills. Did I miss something?
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Furka
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Might have to do with the Triceratops "mummified" specimen ?
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stargatedalek
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I'm not slow! That's just my moe!

Tyranachu
Dec 30 2017, 05:50 AM
What happened to depicting quills on ceratopsians? Lately I've been seeing less and less reconstructions of ceratopsians with quills. Did I miss something?
There was never any evidence for quills on derived ceratopsians to begin with, I can only assume the whole craze was because people found something new and wanted more of it.
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Brach™
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hi

Tyranachu
Dec 30 2017, 05:50 AM
What happened to depicting quills on ceratopsians? Lately I've been seeing less and less reconstructions of ceratopsians with quills. Did I miss something?
the evidence for it was only ever on the little bois like Psittacosaurus. People putting it on the big ones was never based on anything save for their relationship with smaller ceratopsians. its not impossible for Triceratops or Einiosaurus or any of the heavy ones having quills somewhere, I just would keep it subtle like a little beard of quills or subtle fuzz on the tail.
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Incinerox
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Āeksiot Zaldrīzoti

Even then, the rest of Psittacosaurus was scaly, and we have extensive skin impressions from derived ceratopsians which depict fairly large scales compared to other dinosaur groups.

It was a fad that needed to die, basically.
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Cross
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Eldritch Minds

Odd question, but since it has to do with Paleontology, I might as well.
What are some recommended Colleges that I could go to to receive a degree in Paleontology?I'm already halfway through Sophomore Year and I'm about ready to start College Hunting and the likes.
Edited by Cross, Dec 31 2017, 12:09 PM.
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Brach™
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hi

Cross
Dec 31 2017, 12:06 PM
Odd question, but since it has to do with Paleontology, I might as well.
What are some recommended Colleges that I could go to to receive a degree in Paleontology?I'm already halfway through Sophomore Year and I'm about ready to start College Hunting and the likes.
Depends where you're from. If you're from the US then most state universities are a good bet as well as the IVy leagues. they'll usually have something relating to prehistory.
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Fireplume
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Snok Snok Snerson

Yeah IDK where you're from but obvious choices are Colorado and Montana, but easier would be Maryland and Chicago; Berkeley also has a good program but ugh so few people get in.
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Posted Image Flish
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Does anyone have any actual explanation for the "three ton rule" that has popped up recently? All I can find is a blog post by Witton basically saying feathers aren't magic and birds have to evolve tactics to avoid overheating still, but it seems to completely disregard their Mesothermy, among other things, including that there are different types of feather.
Edited by Flish, Jan 1 2018, 08:30 PM.
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magpiealamode
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No good hero is a one-trick phony.

Can you link the post by Witton?

Regardless, it makes sense to me. If the three-ton rule is what I think it is, I buy it--name me an animal today that is over three tons and has a coat of some sort.
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